The one thing that bothers me about most White-washing, or just social justice, blogs in general is that you never seem to be willing to actually address a counter argument without appearing hostile or just plain dismissive. Yes, it's perfectly fine that you are addressing what you feel is a serious problem. What is NOT fine is either being dismissive of other opinions with GIF answers. What's even worse is when you cry out that your own stance is dismissed by the public. Tomato, meet mirror.
So basically, if you're a different skin colour than someone else. You can't treat them like you would a normal person you have to make a big deal out of it and treat them differently. This sounds a bit like racism to me young lady.
It actually is bothersome that the colours were so distinctly off on the projector, since essentially how cartoons work-is that they DO use the same skin tone as a base EACH and EVERY time, and work on top of that, giving it lighting, and shading afterwards. So especially in concept are where there is no shading/lighting... it just doesn't add up. It's the people who are colouring her that are messing up. And it IS annoying. (Sorry, I have a lot of art feelings on this).
I understand the artist feels, believe me.
I’m still learning so I always use my base colors and THEN, add any layers that may change the coloring or shadows on it.
Hmm as your argument is a valid wrong, you're going about it all wrong. You make statements without backing them up with legitimate sources, not to mention you use way too much pathos in your argument. Use some ethos and logos and then you'll have a serious argument. Until then, you're just another bigoted social justice blogger with horrible rhetoric. A common thing on Tumblr.
Ya’ll are under the impression that this is actually up for debate.
This is just a long as PSA for people that need a wakeup call.
I am being overwhelmed by the sheer amount of basic these people are spewing. Korra is brown. Korra is whitewashed. People with internalized(or externalized) racism prefer light skinned Korra over her lovely brownness. And if anyone was ever attacked by a rampaging crowd of black people it would have been all over the headlines: "Rampaging Blacks Attack Innocent White Child!" Because the media likes stories like that.
This blog... it hurts. It really does. Why can't people trust Bryke to, you know, do their own thing? Because it's not like they don't know that if Korra magically turned white between seasons there would be ridiculous amounts of negative publicity that they don't need. You ever think that picture may be due to the lighting, or the photo? Even so, in lighter areas within the show, she has a fairly similar skin color.
Ohman... I'll be so disappointed if Korra is that much lighter in official art and posters when they come out. Even if it does happen, I'll be using all the old ones for reference when I do colour in any Korra art.
Same same (If I ever get back into drawing my ships). I have official art saved and I will not use any new light of her ever.
Protip: It's fine if you don't give a shit about minority representation in media. It's fine if you don't see a problem with whitewashing. It's fine if you wanna go on and on and on about how "colorblind" you are so you can ignore the reality of racism that still exists.
If you wanna be ambivalent. That’s great. You aren’t part of the solution, but at least you aren’t part of the problem. Yeah, yeah, we all bleed the same color. That’s great you aren’t contributing to racism, but thanks a lot for ignoring the racism that is still around anyway.
But the moment you sit there, and tell the people that DO care to “shut up” and that we’re “crazy” and stupid, retarded and oversensitive: You DO become part of the problem. The minute you try to shut down discussion about important issues, and try to silence the people that DO care: you become part of the problem.
If you don’t care, then your “look how much I don’t give a shit about your problems” opinion isn’t needed. It’s not helpful.
(tags aren’t mine but are very true)
Not so casually reblogs this gem that came across my dash.
I remember I had a Gender and Race Studies class, and we were discussing how Crayola once had the light crayon called 'flesh', and how black children preferred coloring with it because it was stated to be prettier. A guy in the class, a white male, said he refused to believe this story, because he couldn't 'understand how a child doesn't have pride in their race'. I brought up the doll test, and he didn't believe it was a valid image of how black children perceive themselves. :|
As a white person, I just wanted to say thank you! I was never really aware of my privilege and such before coming onto tumblr, and it's really helped me to check it, and see that I used to be a racist asshole. You've helped me to be more conscious of things around me, as well as how I describe POC in my writing. So, even if some white people get all butthurt, I just wanted to say thank you, because you're helping to bring equality, and that's pretty damn cool.
Since our dears at DLOTB just got bombarded with annoying messages to the point they had to shut off their messages. I’d like to make my own post (would have made one earlier but I’m a busy girl.)
If this was any other Tom, Dick, or Harry answering a message on their own blog, we wouldn’t care. It would be on the negative level of care because we wouldn’t known it existed. We would have gone on about our days, talking about shadism, whitewashing, racism and the under representation of POC in the media.
But it’s not. And since you are still following, this is directed to you.
You are doing a good job trying to prove you are just a “regular guy”. Because your stance, your attitude is no different than any other of the people that excuse racism or whitewashing.
The only answer to that question should have been “I don’t know.” That’s it. There is no other answer you needed to give anyone because it’s fact you don’t know. That’s not your department.
But as my mom said growing up to people.
"Don’t talk so much, it’ll make people hate you."
No one would have known your stance on whitewashing and under representation. No one. But you opened yourself up to that.
As much as you just want to be seen as a “regular guy”, you can’t. You have a certain level of respect from the Avatar: The Last Airbender and Avatar: Legend of Korra fandom as well as whatever other projects you may work on. You are in a position of authority over many of them. I’ve already seen a few people quote or screen cap your ask in an attempt to silence bloggers from talking about whitewashing. So yes, what you say has weight on people. Because they are holding it as some end all, be all statement on the issue when study after study has said otherwise that the skin color of a character on a cartoon DOES mean something.
We (KINT and DLOTB) have our own certain level of authority as well. Which is why when people whitewash, they come to us, when people have questions about shadism or racism in cosplay, they come to us and quote us and follow by example. And by example, I mean not excusing away intentional or unintentional racist acts. Not internalizing racism. Believing that POC deserve to stay POC and deserve equal representation in anything from their own projects to big hollywood features.
So US (KINT and DLOTB) who’s side is based on fact, science, research studies and years and years of lifes experience gets squashed, not a better word for it is overshadowed, by your stance on the issue, which is no different than any of the bloggers that come to our ask box and reblog stuff from us with faux intelligence only to end with callings us “Social Justice Bloggers” “Crazy” “-Insert Racist Slur-” “-Insert sexist slur-” “Overreacting” ect ect.
So do everyone a favor (or not, you probably won’t anyway) and stay out of this.
Because you don’t, regardless of how old you are, regardless of how young we are, have the knowledge and understanding of this issue to make comments like that.
And this following for whatever reason (You still haven’t answered why), is also no different the people that hate follow. If this issue meant nothing to you, if you don’t care what we say, if the color of cartoons and the reasons why they are important are so unimportant to you, you have no reason to follow us.
Also, I hope you are not under the impression that these are things we wouldn’t say to your face. These are things we stand by, regardless of who the person is. I myself have already once opened in invite to people to get on video chat with me if they were willing to say their baseless arguments to my face (figuratively.) No one took my invite as the anonymity of the internet was gone then.
I think that’s all I have to say.
If there is anything else I’ll write about it at a later time.
To be honest, I don't know. I guess I wanted to know whether they counted or not. I'm really bad at being Mexican. :c I just always see people making a big deal about being racist towards Asians or blacks specifically but I'm always here in the Mexican corner like "Hey... Do we count?" :| So yeah. Sorry for being confusing. You're really cool for dealing with all my off-topic nonsense. :)
Oh yea, Mexicans count. Anyone that’s non white is a Person of Color. XD
We normally deal with Black and Asian because:
Both Mary and I are black so we don’t feel comfortable with dealing with other POC’s issues. If we ever get asked a questions about a race that we aren’t, we normally just forward it to someone else. Which is why we don’t do facial whitewashing a lot. We are in no position to say what one race should or shouldn’t look like. Not our corner, not our call. Unless it is very OUT THERE, like a picture of Storm I posted on my personal blog that the artist used Pam Anderson as the reference, we don’t touch it unless someone of that race brings it to us, like the Toph post. And even then, we leave it to that poster’s commenting and only cosign it.
We deal with Asian stuff though because Legend of Korra and Avatar the Last Airbender is an Asian influence show. So making sure people remember that European concepts don’t belong in that show, like face claiming characters as white actors.
Agreed. I do traditional art and my scanner is awful. What's even worse is not having the right colour at all and find this out when you're already halfway done with everything else. TT_TT But yes. I find your blog really amusing, a little harsh at sometimes, but always with good intentions. Keep it up! Also, I had one question. Where do Hispanics (Central/Southern America. The Spanish are European, of course) fall? I know you're particular about Asians and PoC, so I was wondering...
Where do they fall where?
POC are POC, all that means is anyone that doesn’t fall under the category of white. So all nonwhite Hispanics will fall under POC. :<
umm what the heck why are you hating on Courtney she's an amazing cosplayer and makes a amazing korra,katara,and yue. So,what if someone is using self tanner to make their cosplay more authentic some people aren't naturally tan are you saying pale people can't cosplay their favourite characters because their too pale, that's discrimination sheesh your ridiculous i love korra's brown skin,but stop initiating shit and claiming "white-washing and brown facing" when its not
I always thought that not having the proper skin colour was an insult the the original artist because, well, they drew them that way on purpose. If you're going to do fan art, get the colours right or don't colour it in (especially if you have a computer art programme. There's no excuse, you have every colour ever invented at your finger tips. Honestly. Get it together). But I never realised it was called whitewashing/racism. Yay learning things! :) Thanks guys ^^
Not a problem dear.
I never, will never, have never, gonna never, understand how they can’t get it right on a computer.
I can understand traditional, I’ve only ever called out one traditional piece, because unless you get a big daddy scanner, they are shitty pieces of shit shit on shit toasts and will kill every color you put down.
So I saw this on deviant art. Needless to say I was not amused. When it was pointed out that Korra is looking white the artist said, “Maybe it’s because of the lighting? I made her skin darker than I usually do”
No. It is not the lighting it is you drawing her white
"Darker than I usually do?"
There is a lighter version somewhere in their gallery?
This is great, however you can’t really be the judge of that. Racism/prejudice is ingrained into our cultures as well as our systems/institutions. It’s very difficult not to perpetrate some racist behavior at some point in one’s life. Still, we’re glad to know this. Unfortunately, whitewashing a character is an accepted form of racism, regardless of whether or not you intended to do so. Intent isn’t magical. Just because you didn’t mean for it to be racist/offensive, doesn’t mean it isn’t.
We’re not calling you racist but now we’re curious… try asking yourself why you whitewashed in the first place because this might be reflective of a problematic subconscious. Look deep within.
2. Don’t you think you should be a bit nicer?
3. But so and so character isn’t BLACK (-insert race/ethnicity here)…?
Oh. Lovely. Unless we’ve mistakenly referred to such character as Black, why do you feel the need to tell us this? Have we stated this? Provide links as to where we mistakenly referred to a character as an ethnicity/race they’re not. Show us receipts.
4.Why do you always respond using gifs?
Why are you so mean?
Why do you think we have to constantly provide “proper” and “mature” commentary? Ask yourself that. Ask yourself why you have guidelines and criteria for what you consider to be “appropriate” responses to covert/overt racism. Why do you get to define whether or not we’re behaving as adults? Who set up rules regarding how people of color should respond to damaging ideologies? Hint: Most likely the people who perpetrate said ideologies and oppress people of color. We do not owe anyone anything. And if a mod feels they’d rather respond with a gif, there’s nothing wrong with that. Why are YOU so focused on our response AS OPPOSED TO the problematic post in question?
We aren’t mean unless it’s warranted and weget to determine whether or not it is. Keep in mind that there are five mods here with five different personalities, racial backgrounds and perspectives. We do NOT have to respond to something incendiary in a kind manner. Once again… why are you so focused on our response as opposed to the problematic post in question?
We think you need to check your priorities and stop tone-policing others.
5. What do you think of white people cosplaying characters of color?
All of the mods have different opinions.
On one side of the debate: A few of the mods don’t care. As long as the person isn’t committing Blackface/Brownface/Yellowface, we aren’t particularly annoyed. YOU SHOULD NEVER DARKEN YOUR SKIN TO FIT A CHARACTER’S SKIN COLOR. It is extremely offensive and has far too much negative historical context to ever be acceptable.
Why is it offensive you ask?
Blackface/Brownface/Yellowface have all been used (and continue to be used) to dehumanize and parody Black people, brown people and Asian people respectively. Harmful stereotypes were employed and bolstered/upheld through these “comedic” shows, stereotypes that cause and aid in the perpetration of microaggressions. Racism escalates from such microaggressions before becoming larger, fatal incidents we often hear about on the news.
Regardless of whether or not you are mocking others of different races/ethnicities, darkening your skin is still harmful to others and is a VERY weighted action. We repeat, even if you aren’t parodying another race/ethnicity, is it STILL HURTFUL to others. You cannot separate the racist history from said action JUST BECAUSE YOU want to cosplay and it’s extremely selfish and racist of you to disregard those very real emotions and realities for your own interests.
The skin colors of the very real and very oppressed people (who have to live with the disadvantages that come from it) are NOT COSTUMES.
And NO, it isn’t *just like* painting yourself blue to be a Smurf or green to be the Hulk, not until we start seeing blue and green people walking around, complaining of the oppression and disadvantages they face because of who they are. You get a big fuck you if you even thought of such a thing.
On the other side of the debate: The other mods DO care. It bothers them that out of the MANY white/pale-skinned characters available, of the VAST reserve of white representation, a white person would choose to cosplay a character of color. People of color do not have the equal representation in the media, nor the same support in cosplaying circles. Even when they are cosplaying characters of their skin tone/race, it is evident that white cosplayers are lauded/praised over them, regardless of style or intensity. There are so few characters of color to begin with, a white person cosplaying a character of color just adds insult to injury.
THOUGH EACH MOD HAS A DIFFERENT OPINION ON CERTAIN ASPECTS OF IT, WE ALL AGREE THAT REGARDLESS OF RACE/ETHNICITY, IT IS WRONG TO DARKEN ONE’S SKIN IN ANY WAY FOR THE SOLE PURPOSE OF COSPLAYING.
6. Do you hate white people?
No, and it is very telling that you’d have to ask that. We hate whiteness/white supremacy. White people are not synonymous whiteness/white supremacy although more often than not, they help enforce it/uphold it.
7. What is whiteness? Do you mean you hate whiteness as in the skin color?
8. Wait, but I’m a person of color. I don’t see anything wrong with that artwork (whitewashing) so why do you?
Unless you can offer a valid description of how the artwork is not whitewashed, we cease to give a fuck about your opinion, regardless of your race/ethnicity.
9. Do you know anything about color theory?
Are any of the mods artists?
Yes and yes. We find it very funny that those opposing this blog throw out that phrase so often and then clearly exhibit that they have no knowledge of it themselves.
10. What makes you think you’re qualified to criticize someone’s art?
We do not criticize their art style nor their level of skill. We are not putting them down, however we are offering a quick and valid critique: you whitewashed and it’d be nice if you fixed that.
11. Do you consider albino people of color to be white?
This question makes us laugh every time. Regardless of skin color, a person of color is a person of color.
12. What do you think of white characters racebent as people of color?
We often get this question because people probably feel it’s unfair that we showcase racebent artwork. Too motherfucking bad. Whitewashing =/= racebending.
13. Are the mods even POCs?
14. What if they’re just a bad artist?
If you whitewash,your art will end up here, regardless of *skill*.
15. Why don’t you SHOW them how to shade people of color?
We now have a tutorial section that we update as regularly as we can. We also accept submissions of tutorials. But even if we didn’t, why do WE have to teach YOU to shade people of color? If you’re whitewashing, that is something YOU should actively be attempting to fix. THAT is not OUR job. Accountability is key.
Not so casually stealing their faq
(I really need to update this blog’s picture faq but I’m so lazy!)
How do you feel about lighter-skinned cosplayers dressing up as darker characters?
I, I, I I,I, little i, I, I, motherfucking I, one more time, I, don’t care.
Don’t brownface and I won’t care. I literally will not bat an eye lash and will probably ignore then cause I’m looking for my brown skinned folk to love and praise, but I, will not give them either negative or positive attention because they are not on MY radar.
There are other POC that do care and don’t like it because of the light skinned privilege they have in the cosplay world.
I wanted to share this with you as fast as I could, they are already giving the orginal poster that shared with important picture with us and harassing them and bullying them, to the point where they wanted to take it down. (Which I knew was about to happen) :/ voice and educate everyone why this is wrong. Thank you dear <3
First, if you didn’t know, Sifu Kisu was the martial arts director (?) for Avatar: The Last Airbender. And I believe he worked a little on Legend of Korra.
If you don’t remember him, he was the one the fans called out for posting a sexist joke and his half assed apology only managed to make more people mad.
So the fact he even thought of answering this even though he’s made it perfectly clear he’s unable and unwilling to learn about issues that mean nothing to him annoys me.
Another thing that’s annoying me before I get into the meat of this issue is this fandom.
Stop running to the staff for all your issues and ‘fandom squabbles’.
One, he is not on the design staff or works with anyone that would have that knowledge. If they are sitting around talking about how they lightened a character with every Tom, Dick, and Harry, they obviously don’t have anything of real importance to do with their life. And have a whole new level of ignorance floating around.
Two, the people that run to the staff are just glorified tattle tails. If there was a real problem, like someone in the harassing and stalking someone in the fandom (which is probably happening but NOONE is going to them about that) that would be a different story. Instead of taking it up with the people who make these post, or just doing like everyone else does and passively aggressively makes a post on their own blog that will later just be lost into the tumblr graveyard, they go to the staff looking for some form of validation and authority in an attempt to silence folks with their concerns.
I know one issue got the fandom very mad and ran to Bryan and he made a comment about how the fans got into a fight. Half the comments I saw were people saying how embarrassed they were about Bryan founding out, shaming them into thinking their stance on the issue was invalid. It shames people into being silent and being afraid to make valid criticism on a topic because then the staff will find out and public speak in against or the side of indifference.
This is one of the times they spoke out in indifference.
A simple answer would have been his last line of “Sorry, I don’t know.”
Because he doesn’t know, noone came make a man who doesn’t work that close with any of the design decision know why they have lightened the characters for the comic con panel.
But he inserted his own opinion.
His opinion is not different from any of the other people on tumblr. Who cares? He obviously doesn’t have the knowledge to understand WHY having brown characters on a cartoon show are important. He obviously doesn’t understand that representation of brown people in the media matter. I can go into his own indifference or refusal to answer questions of his own race but I’ll leave that for when people want to (and will) send messages to this ask box.
This is something that the fandom can throw around when people say “That character is whitewashed” they will quote, just like they stay on MLK and Morgan Freeman’s, in order to ‘prove’ to the fandom is being ‘irrational’ and “SEE SEE, HE DOESN’T CARE, WHY DO YOU CARE!”
I’m going to sit and wait for another half assed apology, the huge Kisu circle jerk that is already starting, and acting like a child, AGAIN.
So, late in the game, but I was going through this blog and at first I was confused what you were so angry about with the Korra cosplayer. So I went back to the beginning of the thread to figure out what was going on, and wow, it never occurred to me that people would genuinely tan for cosplay. But I totally understand your anger. And, as someone with a little background in theatrical makeup, things you've said will definitely play a role in any future projects I take on. Thank you.
[Edit- Tumblr message fuck ups didn’t tell me what blog this was for. XD]
I don’t want to bash the artist nor the people who did not notice the wrong color of skin Sakimichan drew Korra in. If one actually read the comments, they would be really pissed off since some commentors suggest that the reason why Korra’s skin is pinkish light(or whatever tan they suggest it is) is because of the light. Light does not change a person’s skin tone that much, yet most people don’t notice (esp. if they are white). I have not seen any tumblr blog that has posted this yet, so I hope you guys don’t mind me submitting this :)
No mind at all.
I haven’t seen this but I’m glad you submitted it, I’ll submit it again with the actual picture so people can see if they don’t wanna click the link.
But yea, no. She’s pink as hell, not brown at all.
I think people have just never hung out with a brown person before or else they’d notice what they look like in the sun, or else they are one of those colorblind people.